This blog is intended to be a neutral ground where all can discuss their issues with the Unitarian Universalist Association and its member congregations. It is also a place where those criticisms can be answered and challenged in turn. The only ground rules are these: No personal insults, no armchair psychoanalyzing, no spamming. Address people by their proper names; no nicknames or "cute" references; something you may find funny another may find offensive. No links unless they are absolutely necessary to understand the issue. Keep the discussion about the discussion; don't label the arguments made (such as "DIM" or "irrational")- labels do not advance understanding. Simply agree with them or refute them.
Anyone wishing to start a new thread can submit it as a comment, and I will copy it as a new post, with its own address, that people can comment on and refer to- just mention that this is what you want to do.
Please jump in!
Humanism vs. Theism: Does anyone actually care anymore?
ReplyDeleteA few months ago, as an experiment, I asked the UU theology mailing list if anyone had seen or experienced any atheists giving theists grief or vice versa IN THE LAST COUPLE OF YEARS. I emphasize that last bit because lots of people have stories of mistreated theists that are a decade or two old, and they always seem to tell them as if they happened yesterday. I wondered if it ever happened anymore or if we just talked about it like it did.
I got one "yes" response, and that it was an incident from several years ago and soon after, his/her church got a new minister who made it clear that this behavior wouldn't be tolerated and there hasn't been an issue since.
That one "yes" aside, literally no one had seen any anti-theism or anti-atheism in their churches on the last couple of years. But several people still announced that "theism vs. atheism" was this incredibly important divide within UUism. I really don't understand why. To me it seems like the idea of people being actually mistreated and churches being divided on "theism vs anti-theism" or "atheism vs. humanism" is a big Boogeyman that scares lots of UUs but is mostly illusory.
Do you see "the God question" as something that divides your church right now? Have you seen anyone actually treated badly because of their faith in the last couple of years? If not, are se sure it's really that big a deal anymore?
Are UUs who don't really care about UUA politics on a ship of fools?
ReplyDeleteOn the Chaliceblog, I wrote an open letter to a YRUUer of mine who apparently has been reading the blog.
In it, I pointed out that the Chaliceblog addresses conflicts within the denomination that lots of UUs really don't care about.
In response from Robin, I got the following comment:
(((("Plenty of UUs seem to sail through their religious lives without really thinking through the conflicts that go on under the surface of the denomination."
I couldn't have said it better myself CC. . . I may even put that quote to good use while pointing out that such oblivious, if not willfully ignorant, U*Us are sailing on a U*U Ship Of Fools. :-))))
I don't see UUs who aren't that interested in denominational politics or UUA arguments as "on a ship of fools" at all. For an extreme example, there's no denying that the Catholic Church was pretty fucked up at the time Mother Theresa was doing her work in Calcutta. Are we to call her a "fool" because she wasn't in Rome fighting the good fight to reshape her church's priorities?
Even if most UUs are getting what they need out of the church and devoting that extra time to their families or their jobs or what have you rather than feeding the starving in India, I'm not inclined to judge.
I'm sure the ones who are involved in national politics think I'm a fool for not spending my time on that.
CC
My reply to CC's comment, regarding UUs and UUA politics:
ReplyDeleteI think the varying attitudes towards UUA politics is both a matter of degree and a matter of priorities. Our congregation has hosted a weekly supper program for the city's needy, which depends little (if at all) on support from the denomination; so I wouldn't be the least bit surprised when a UU who devotes so much time and energy to this effort, thinks and cares little about who sits on the UUA Board or how decisions are implemented.
But there's a big difference between putting UUA politics low on one's priority list, and ignoring it completely. In my own work on sexuality issues, I often depend on resources from the UUA. Do I feel a need to know every detail of UUA politics? No. But I do need to know enough, and be involved in the discussion, not only in connection with my own work. but in support of other UU's efforts in this and other important issues.
Yes, I think it has a lot to do with what work in the church moves you. Admittedly, our Youth Ministry Coordinator does a lot of the work with the UUA, so my primary interaction with the politics of the church comes from blogging.
ReplyDeleteBut yeah, we have a lot of adults in the church like the ones who do y'alls supper for the homeless and I don't at all think of them as foolish for not being that interested.
CC